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Have the devs actually played as a Shaman?


#1

I can’t figure out why Shaman damage is atrocious. I’ve tried scaling spell damage and physical damage when using melee abilities, but the skills don’t actually scale with melee because they don’t have the melee tag. Only swipe and Leap.

I’ve made several different shaman, but any build that relies on spell damage, totems or Attunement feels like a waste of time.

One of my shaman is about level 25. I just got Tornado. Have 18 Attunement. Which scales spell damage according to the tooltips. Tried putting spell damage on my gear, and go to use Tornado and it literally hits for 9 damage a tick. A tick being approx 1-1.5 seconds. For a spell that costs 25 mana to do 9 seconds every 1-2 seconds is terrible. The spell expires after about 4-5 seconds, and it can barely wound small mobs 10 levels weaker than me.

Running totem builds feels incredibly terrible, they can’t survive attacks, especially Storm Totem. The skill does “okay damage” but for being on an 8 second cooldown, and it often being focused down by ranged enemies that drop fire or something on the totem instantly killing it makes it feels lackluster in every way.

How are you supposed to level as this class? I’ve tried healing my totems to empower them but the damage boost and heal feels negligable at best, still dying shortly after, with the heal just outright dumping your mana. Are we supposed to just level with beasts until late game and never play totems and spells until later and just suffer through early levels?

For the melee builds, as I said before the only melee skill that really scales off attacks and passives is Swipe. The skill does like no single target damage and feels like you just pretend that you’re scaling at around the 30-40 range.


#2

I think this class is just unfinished right now. I also couldn’t figure a decent way to build a shaman.
It looks like there are only 2 way it can be done:

  1. Tornadoes + totems, so a spellcaster. But as you said the damage is terrible and mana management limits you very much.

  2. A melee build as it has a lot of elemental melee nodes. But i don’t see any good primary attack skill for melee that actually scales with elemental damage.


#3

Just a little tip for totem scaling, they scale from minion damage. Read the loading screen tips once in a while, they got useful information about stuff like this :smile:


#4

It doesn’t make them feel less worse though. They still die in 3 hits and do minimal damage even with all the attunement nodes you can get and minion bonus to minion damage nodes.


#5

I just installed the beta yesterday, so I’m really new to the game, but I started a Shaman, who is around lvl ~25 as well, and so far my damage seems fine. (I don’t have a comparison of other chars, but killing packs in ~2 Seconds and Bosses in… 5-10 apart from “Story bosses” seems fine to me)
I went with minion buffs on gear, attunement because I want to build something like pet/totem hybrid. I find it weird that Totems say “Minion, Spell” in their description. From that description I’d assume they would scale with my own +Spell% aswell…is there a stat for “Minion Spell %” as well?

Apart from that, I find the thorn totem vastly superior to the storm totem at the Moment, I cast 4 of them in one cast, and the damage exploded once I picked the Attack Cone Upgrades. Just getting 170 Degree instead of 360 more than doubles the damage (easy math).
(EDIT: Apparently this doesn’t add to the single-target damage at all…maybe it increased the DPS simply because more Spikes hit enemies in General.)

Still, the Wolf seems to be a better damage dealer, I went the lightning-damage road on the bottom right with him and am now going for a second one. But the 4 Thorn Totems are REALLY useful once you get the cone reduction. (And if cast first, let the storm totem live longer by diverging the aggro)

Also I wondered, since the totems are minions, they should be affected by the Rage Totem right? From the Damage I see on them there isn’t much of a difference though, while the wolf becomes vastly more deadly with it active…

I actually thought Totem Shaman seems a bit overpowered currently, since you spam so many Targets that nothing aggros on you, and you can recast the thorn totems before they die :smiley:


#6

I have a Shaman 60+ at this point, and here’s some things I learned.
Shamans are very weak early level. You won’t start to feel good til 45-50+
Shamans are weaker than other classes, they need some boots
I built my Shaman around 3x wolves, which keep aggro, then I drop my Thorn Totems on a pack (I 100% recommend getting the summon them all as a ring node, and the heat seeking node–I also use the first cone fire node–this can likely be optimized, but it’s worked the best for me) – then I drop a storm totem, since it seems extra squishy, then I drop my frenzy totem. I scale minion damage everywhere I can. My gear is kinda so-so, but I’m sitting at over 450% minion damage, ~200% minion life (to keep them alive), and just under 1k life.

For building their gear, you want to focus on Minion Damage %, Health +/%, Attunement. Attunement is more or less for level 60+, where you can get nodes that scale your spell damage PER totem you have spawned-240% extra spell damage is decent. I use Tornado to sweep mobs together for totems to kill, its damage seems weak overall. Avalanche is ridiculously good, but it doesn’t have a skill tree yet–when it gets one, we’ll be in a good place.
IGNORE ALL MELEE SKILLS–Shaman is not a melee class. Use the leap if you want to, but personally, I like the three totems+wolves+tornado for my serious business build. Wolves are really the glue that keep everything together, and can easily be modded to get 2x more wolves. Very helpful.


#7

Awsome, good to know I’ll be ok in a few levels :slight_smile: basically the same build I’ve been doing on my shaman (right now I have the insta heal over the thorn totems, though skilling them up).
Tried the cold conversion on the storm totem for a bit, but don’t think I liked it much (seemed to do more CC / freeze and a lot less damage)


#9

I actually have fantastic success with a physical melee shaman scaling Str.

+15% melee damage PER totem, +90% physical damage/stun chance if I have a totem out, +50 elemental, void, necrotic, poison resist PER totem. With 6-9 totems up (5x thorn totem, storm totem (flat dmg buff - frenzy totem still probably better), and random claw totems from swipe) the buffs are significant. Tornado to group mobs and buff attack speed.

Its really just a swipe/leap build with totems and tornado to buff…I’ve found actual minions to die too easily to support melee abilities and totems have been great instead.

I’ll try a spellcasting shaman soon. Ignite tornado, although strangely out of place in Shaman, could be extremely powerful.

Having said that…storm totem needs to not die from a fart.


#10

Good tips, thanks - I’m doing something similar…

I’m going for a little more focus on the lightning minion dmg nodes, using 2 wolves and the lightning nodes on the bottom-right, plus Storm Totem specced into Thunder Totem and the death-nova node (because it is squishy, yes). With the flat and % minion lightning Shaman passives scaling both the wolves and storm totem, it’s not bad.

Also using Thorn totem with poison nodes to shield the storm totem, but I like recasting them as I need to, so I’ve gone for 2/3 extra totems and not taken the summon-all ring cast.

It’s not bad at all - just hit 40 and reached the monolith, no issues so far. Also the Vale Spirit does lightning attacks (I think?) so I may look at taking the extra companion passive and fit that into the build (especially when it gets a tree!) - more lightning-scaled-stuff, yay :slight_smile:


#11

I’m basically going the same route, two lightning wolves, Thunder-Totem, Frenzy Totem (ridicously strong even without a tree), Thorn Totems…aaand currently Thorn Burst, spec’ed to be castable on allies. It works okay when spammed on the wolves…
BTW I went to the bottom left on the wolves, and got my +1 companion from there, it doesn’t have a downside there which I like.
I’m currently skilling Druid towards the Spriggan Companion as replacement of the thorn burst, we’ll see how that goes.

But one Thing I wonder, maybe @SlaserX can grant me some insight on higher Levels:
How does a (Caster-/Pet-)Shaman get his defense? Mages/Acolytes have their Ward, Melee-Chars have Leech… we can bolster our Defense and Resistances through Passive Nodes that scale on Totem Number, but I don’t see a way to replenish health once we got hit apart from Potions…?
And even with high protection, we can’t facetank since we don’t get any health back, right?
Is it pure Evasion that keeps us alive later on? Or am I missing some form of “active replenishment”?

PS: Vale Spirit does Lightning Damage yes (EDIT: Just read the skill, it does not do Lightning damage, only Spell), and is a minion. But currently it stops attacking altogether after 20-40 seconds (at least for me), that got on my nerves so much that I switched it out again :smiley: I like the Vale Spirit very much generally. (But you Need to be careful, the Spirit’s Hitbox is actually inside your character, so whenever the Spirit aggros something, they’ll attack you/your area.)

EDIT2: I felt too squishy in Timelines, but especially arena, so I went Ice Totem, and wow, they are an AMAZING crowd control. Thinking about respecializing them and remove the Cone Reduction, to gain slows and freezes all around.


#12

ok cool idea shaman but one of less funny build no interatcion oly minion you escape and run away, desctipion say you are the storm…where? tornado its cool, storm totem pls leave and give some like lighting strike fell us we can command the storm…i refuse to use thorn totem and freanzy totem


#13

Its not hard. Plenty of good nodes to improve melee elemental damage. Go up to those 2 nodes which improve damage/defenses per totem, run 3 of them(max number thorn, storm with even more lightning damage to melee attacks and frenzy), get the elemental damage from swipe + the claw totem, get the healing totem from druid, get lighting storm leap, finish it with some nodes in beastmaster, the strength + life, the damage reduction and the attack/move speed ones are pretty sweet. You don’t need a single companion, just you and the totems.

Spell damage shaman is pretty bad though. Cold damage is lacking support too.


#14

Yeah, seems like no matter what you do, as Primalist you always have some minion skills, and you lack the pure Spelldamage nodes of Mage for example.

Also I haven’t understood what the concept of a caster Druid would be… Spriggan Form, Entangling Roots… Spriggan would be a minion again and without Minion Stats on Items useless…same with Totems (I guess Frenzy Totem will get some Spell-Bonus Nodes though)… Tornado from Shaman? Or has Spriggan Form no Cooldown? You’d probably go Physical Spell and Poison I guess, so Tornado isn’t that hot either…Blade Thicket? Yuck. Vale Spirit is a Minion again.
Has anyone tried a caster druid yet? Because the Druid Nodes seem kind of underwhelming overall. And the “on hit” Spells/Totems cast don’t seem too useful either, because as Caster Druid you ideally don’t want to get hit regulary right? :thinking:
I’ll try to build one for sure, but I have a feeling that I’ll end up with Spriggan Form, Poison Thorn Totems, Entangling Roots, Blade Thicket (just because there’s nothing else really…), Scorpion maybe? For more Poison? Or the Heal? (Which I find kind of underwhelming, but didn’t give it a proper testing) Dunno.
I can imagine a Melee Werebear Druid rather easy, there the on-hit things also make sense, but I find it difficult imagining useful synergies for a Caster Druid, the utmost Passives seem counter-intuitive for a caster druid.


#15

They haven’t introduced the spell-based transformation yet. Druids in WoW have 3, since this game clearly borrows ideas from there eventually a spall-based druid form will be included. Maybe one of those human/avian guys.


#16

Isn’t the Spriggan Form the Spell-based transform?


#17

In theory it should be the heal based one because the spriggan is a healing minion.


#18

Yeah, but a healer in an ARPG? :smile: I mean I like the spriggan as heal companion, especially to support the wolves, but I don’t think a more or less dedicated healer form has a place in an ARPG does it?
I could see it as support for your minions in a pure pet build maybe, but then it’s placed a bit weird in the druid tree, that leans the most towards no-pet or one-pet builds :thinking:

EDIT: Wait a second… “On hit”-Nodes don’t mean “When you are hit” but “When you hit an enemy?” That changes everything :man_facepalming: Then all those “On Hit” Nodes in the Druid Tree are actually useful for a caster druid O_O And I misunderstood all the “on hit”-Stuff insert Mind Blown GIF here :smiley:


#19

I think Shaman is kind of in its own place defense wise–your best options (imo) are scaling the resistances per totem nodes, life+/%, and not being hit (let your totems soak up the damage). I get whipped pretty bad if I don’t have totems out. They seem to pull aggro fairly well, and that’s more or less how I survive anything. It is dangerous though, I don’t even have leap (no room on my bar, since I use Tornado–leap if for speedrunning).


#20

Yeah, the Problem I have with that is that you then always have to go with at least minion health% IMHO.
I’m currently leveling up a second primalist to go caster druid, plan is going mainly poison/dot with physical damage as secondary, the spriggan as single companion, and thorn totem circle with poison nodes to add up.
BTW: How does %increased DoT/Poison work, when the DoTs are split between me and minions? Are they just split/added up as is? (20 per stack from minions, 40 from me if I have +100%, and this added number multiplied with 20%*number of total stacks?)

Maybe Eterra’s Blessing will get an instant-cast node and maybe also Regen+/Heal over Time/Protection+, so that it becomes a useful survival skill.


#21

Interested in hearing some other people’s feedback and experiences are similar to yours. I’m level 30 with my Shaman right now and am absolutely shitting on everything with a thorn-totem setup. I have no idea how it will scale into high arena or level 95+ but right now it feels very strong, but I am using a unique 1 hander I found is carrying me… Clearly we can all agree specs shouldn’t need uniques to function but just thought you may have something in the stash to help push through the levels until you can get a ton of passive tree damage.